adamb
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Registered: Sept 22, 2016 17:21:05 GMT -7
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Post by adamb on Mar 21, 2017 10:17:58 GMT -7
The bane of this motorcycle. With ability to use this machine for double duty, track days/street riding, this questions what to do about tires. With only 3,000 miles and am do for my 3rd set of rubber. The stock bridgestones made it 1900 miles and had 30% tread remaining, but where not suited for track days.
The current Pirelli Diablo Rosso Corsa did very well at my skill level on the track, and felt great on the street. The down side they have 900 miles and are worn to 3/32 rear, and 4/32 front. At this tread depth I could possibly get one more track day from the rear, but would be worried about grip level. With the first event of the year this Sunday, a new rear will be installed. $190.00. I plan on doing 6 events a year from April to November. I guesstimate yearly mileage 6,000, which would put my tire expensive around $1500 at the current rate I’m consuming tires.
Option 1, dedicated track wheels, dedicated street wheels.
Positives:
No compromise for traction at the track
Higher mileage tires for the street
Least time consuming
No worries about wear and tear on track wheels
Cons:
Initial investment north of $2,000
Tire warmers would be needed for track rubber
Option 2, Two sets of tires one set of wheels. Now paying for mount balance would make this option pointless, so this would have to be a DIY only.
Positives:
Lower cost
Better performance tires for track
Higher mileage tires for the street
Cons:
Time consuming
Lots of wear and tear to the stock rims
Dedicated track rubber means tire warmer investment
Option 3 continue with Street/Track tire
Positives:
Easiest option
Slightly less wear and tear on rims than option 2
Cons:
Long term, the most expensive
Always a compromise with traction
Option 4, Dedicated track only bike
Positives:
Can find old race bikes setup sub $4000
Not as concerned with damaging during a accident
Already setup for track life
Cons:
High initial cost
Twice the maintenance, two bikes(well really 3 with my dirt bike)
Wife
Storage
Wife
I’d much prefer option 1, but would rather find used wheels to lower the initial cost. That being said I don’t know what wheels would be compatible, other than new R1, which are going for a premium price point. Does anyone have a info on wheels that will fit? Also taking into account the need for reluctor rings will need to be used. Any wisdom from those that have pondered this same thing?
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harrybalzak
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Registered: Mar 2, 2017 11:17:12 GMT -7
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Post by harrybalzak on Mar 21, 2017 10:36:14 GMT -7
Hands down without a doubt a dedicated track bike assuming you can swing it. Honestly very little extra maintenance and when compared to the other options of mounting and balancing tires or changing wheels 6-7 times a year, actually less. You get an actual super sport bike designed for the exact purpose you would be using it. No need to worry about wadding up your $13k+ street bike and then not having one. Plus one should never pass up having more bikes.
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latte
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Registered: Jan 19, 2017 2:06:59 GMT -7
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Post by latte on Mar 21, 2017 13:31:30 GMT -7
Dedicated track bike so the expenses (and heartache if unlucky) aren't as high. Don't get me wrong, the FZ is great fun and it is definitely up to snuff at the track, but it may be more economical to pick up an already tracked out supersport on the cheap.
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botticelli
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Post by botticelli on Mar 21, 2017 23:00:10 GMT -7
I too vote track bike. A good 600 ready to go can be had for 3-4k ready to rock. I run Q3's or slicks on my track bikes, the Q3's do a great job without warmers, decent life too. After binning(complete total loss high side) a limited edition Ducati 996 - Matrix on its first trip to the track, I adopted this mentality and will never go back.
Street bikes for the street and track bikes for the track. Also I hate taping lights.
Just my .02
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adamb
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Registered: Sept 22, 2016 17:21:05 GMT -7
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Post by adamb on Mar 22, 2017 16:25:45 GMT -7
This should be a fun topic of discussion with the wife, who also wants a new car.
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Post by 0002s on Mar 22, 2017 18:42:28 GMT -7
Option 4
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adamb
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Post by adamb on Mar 24, 2017 17:23:15 GMT -7
Been spending a lot of time on the Wera for sale forum. 07-09 Japanese 600's are what Im huntingfor. Ive ridden a 3 super sports, less than 50 miles total, and have always had a bike with regular handle bars. That being said the clip-ons seem unnatural to me and doesn't steer as easily. So maybe I should look into the SV650 instead? Opinions?
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guywithfz10
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Post by guywithfz10 on Mar 24, 2017 18:01:30 GMT -7
Been spending a lot of time on the Wera for sale forum. 07-09 Japanese 600's are what Im huntingfor. Ive ridden a 3 super sports, less than 50 miles total, and have always had a bike with regular handle bars. That being said the clip-ons seem unnatural to me and doesn't steer as easily. So maybe I should look into the SV650 instead? Opinions? It's much easier to steer at lower speeds with handlebars but having clip-ons with high rearsets puts you in that race position ready to lean into a corner or go into a full tuck. Leaning off a bike with handlebars feels a bit awkward compared to clip-ons because of the wide grip. I would say for a track bike go for a R6. The bike hasn't changed for 10 years so there are tons of parts available so if you go down at the track you can find parts easily and fix it back up. |
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adamb
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Registered: Sept 22, 2016 17:21:05 GMT -7
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Post by adamb on Mar 27, 2017 16:03:57 GMT -7
Did another track day yesterday with -10. It really is a fun bike on the track, though that must be taken with a grain of salt being the only bike I've ever ridden on the track, and my 2nd event ever. The pirreli is dead on the sides now, still some life left in the center. The tire was spinning coming out of every corner, and down most of the straight aways in 4th gear. After lunch I was bumped into intermediate and had a blast following those guys, though I couldnt power out of the corners, -10 was able to make up the ground on the brakes. Great fun which cements the idea of buying track bike before I put the -10 in the weeds, plus already have to wife onboard with the idea.
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decreasingdave
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Post by decreasingdave on Apr 16, 2017 7:42:06 GMT -7
You need to begin to program your mind into knowing that it's "just a trackday", and use the track time for what it's intended for, learning. After years of racing, I have a tendency to hit the track and try running 110%, sliding both into and out of turns, etc. I have to tell myself that "it's just a trackday". I use it for learning to be smoother, more consistent, learn the bike and the tires that I ride with on the street. That is what the biggest benefit of doing a trackday with your dedicated streetbike. Using the track time to be a better street rider.
So my thought is, if you're going to go out onto the track and push yourself that hard, just for the sake of going fast, get yourself a dedicated track bike. You are probably doing your street skills very little benefit by just going out and pushing your limits for the sake of final product, vs. striving on learning to be smooth and consistent.
If you try my way of doing trackdays, you may be slower at first, but the speed will come. Whereas going out pushing, the speed is there but smoothness and consistency probably will never be.
My opinion, and only my opinion. Not trying to be insulting, just going by my personal experience, and I have a bunch.
Dave
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harry76
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Post by harry76 on Apr 16, 2017 8:06:29 GMT -7
We are getting ready to upgrade our track bikes, we have 2 01 R6s both with excellent suspension, one with built 636 motor, both with track plastics.
Lots of extra parts, 2k, your choice.
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decreasingdave
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Post by decreasingdave on Apr 16, 2017 9:05:04 GMT -7
We are getting ready to upgrade our track bikes, we have 2 01 R6s both with excellent suspension, one with built 636 motor, both with track plastics. Lots of extra parts, 2k, your choice. This seems like a pretty good deal for someone that just needs a trackday bike.
Dave
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adamb
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Post by adamb on Apr 16, 2017 12:00:58 GMT -7
Dave, I appreciate your advice and thanks for responding. Now I have very little track time, and for that matter street riding time. But isn't a byproduct of being smooth and consistent lower lap times? (I'm not even concerned about my times at this point)
I agree that going out at 100% is going to land you on the ground. The way I've gone about the track day is to link up with a control rider, learn the line, brake points and acceleration point.
I'm currently at my 4th event of the year, after 4 laps the corner works called the director and had me bumped to advance group. This group really has allowed my to learn the most, with ability to have mostly clear track and work on body position, brake points more consistently.
As a side note driven rearsets will grind the brake lever at full lean. So if you are looking at rearsets to do track days be aware.
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decreasingdave
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Post by decreasingdave on Apr 16, 2017 14:49:18 GMT -7
Dave, I appreciate your advice and thanks for responding. Now I have very little track time, and for that matter street riding time. But isn't a byproduct of being smooth and consistent lower lap times? (I'm not even concerned about my times at this point) I agree that going out at 100% is going to land you on the ground. The way I've gone about the track day is to link up with a control rider, learn the line, brake points and acceleration point. I'm currently at my 4th event of the year, after 4 laps the corner works called the director and had me bumped to advance group. This group really has allowed my to learn the most, with ability to have mostly clear track and work on body position, brake points more consistently. As a side note driven rearsets will grind the brake lever at full lean. So if you are looking at rearsets to do track days be aware. Yes, it is a byproduct, which is mostly my point. Practicing being smooth and consistent on the track will definitely help you on the street. Whereas just going out bonsai on the track may give you instant speed and lower lap times, but little else, even over time.
It sounds like you have your head in the right place, good on you. There are tires that will do excellent during trackdays and yet still give you decent mileage on the street. You can only expect about 3,000 miles tops out of a rear, less if you track it too. You should get roughly two rears to a front.
My advice, two things, if you wish to learn what you can do on the FZ-10 on the street by riding the track, pick a tire that allows you to do both with good grip and reasonable mileage. Then learn to ride the pace on the track that affords you searching the limits of the tire, suspension and handling of the bike. This way, what you learn on the track will directly correspond to your street riding should you need it. At least you will know what the bike and tires CAN do, even if you (smartly) don't reach that level on the street.
Second thing is that if you have more desire to drop your lap times on the track, you should get a dedicated trackbike with track tires to do just that. You will still learn speed by working on being smooth and consistent, and it will somewhat translate to the FZ-10 on the street, but it is a different bike. So while the physics and overall concept will translate, in practical form it will be different simply because the bike is different.
Never stop learning. Set a goal to work on certain techniques, certain corners, your drive, something. This way when you come off of the trackday after blowing through hundreds of dollars in both cash and stuff, you have a product that's worth millions, especially if it keeps you off the ground one day.
Dave
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adamb
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Post by adamb on Apr 17, 2017 14:29:02 GMT -7
 Because threads are better with pictures |
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adamb
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Post by adamb on Apr 17, 2017 14:54:34 GMT -7
Dave, your insight is invaluable, again thanks for responding. I think personally Ive found the limits I'd like to push this bike in its current setup. I'm sure a more talented rider could push it further, or I could add slick tires, suspension , and get even more out of it. But I'd rather spend that money on a dedicated machine for track use, and I feel the faster I ride it the likelihood of it coming less shiny increases. The current diablo rosso corsa tires have been decent, and am able to ride them until they slide without much drama. At the current rate it looks like I'll get 3 rear tires to 1 front.
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