wiiface100
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Post by wiiface100 on Sept 25, 2022 14:15:20 GMT -7
Hey everyone! First things first this is only my second post to this forum, and I'm really only used to reddit. So forgive me for bad formatting or failed comment replies. So almost a year ago my 2021 MT-10 had a catastrophic failure with the engine and itb lew up. There was a previous post about it here. fz10.org/thread/4171/another-blown-mt-10-engineThis was not posted by me and I just happened to find it here. So the dealer was going to rebuild the motor and I was seriously not comfortable with this. I stressed the fact that I wanted a crate motor from Yamaha and would not accept a dealer built motor from scratch. They basically ended up telling me tough luck. So I reached out to a lemon law firm and they go in touch with Yamaha for me. They said if they weren't able to do anything for me that they wouldn't charge me for their services. And if we won Yamaha would pay the legal fees. So it sounded like a good deal. For reference yes, the bike had no cat, an Austin racing exhaust and midpipe, and no tune. It was ridden like that for less than 800 miles. I was seriously concerned that if I tried to lemon it that Yamaha would look deeper into this than as compared to a normal warranty claim. My fear was that they would see the exhaust and just tell me to kick rocks as I've voided the warranty. Then I would be stuck with the bike and a blown motor, and have to pay to get it repaired under my own dime to the tune of roughly $10,000~. Luckily the lawyer came through and got me two options. Option 1: Warranty the bike like the dealer said, and get a settlement to make me feel okay with the situation. They wanted me to make an offer and did not have an offer for me. Option 2: Yamaha would buy the bike back for every penny I've spent. Tax, title, and interest on the loan included. I did not feel comfortable keeping the bike unless they agreed to an unreasonable settlement I wouldn't do it. So I just let them buy the bike back, and I got to keep my exhaust! As for what happened to the engine, I will never know. Yamaha asked the dealer to not touch anything on the bike and to leave it exactly how it came into the dealer since technically they were being sued. So the engine was actually never opened up. I wish I had more info for you guys as to what happened to the motor but I simply don't have anything to tell you. So that's what happened. I have an order on and MT-10 SP with the local Yamaha dealer with no delivery ETA. I am fully aware that other dealers may have them, but I bought my last two bikes with the dealer, and I know they won't charge me insane mark ups on the new bike. Where I'm sure another dealer will. So that's the update everyone. If your MT-10 blows up under warranty, I do suggest getting a lawyer involved. You may end up being able to have it rebuilt and get some money out of it. |
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kyle
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Post by kyle on Sept 25, 2022 15:12:12 GMT -7
Wow! Crazy story! Thanks so much for the update.
I hope that you're able to get delivery of an SP model sometime soon. It seems that there is very limited stock. I was able to find a base model around 200 miles away from me; but didn't have to pay crazy markup.
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wiiface100
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Post by wiiface100 on Sept 25, 2022 18:20:46 GMT -7
Wow! Crazy story! Thanks so much for the update. I hope that you're able to get delivery of an SP model sometime soon. It seems that there is very limited stock. I was able to find a base model around 200 miles away from me; but didn't have to pay crazy markup. I'm glad you were able to find one with no mark up at all. I called another dealer after finding a poster on here who had a link to on stock sp's. They had a $5000 markup!!! Wtf. I asked if they would do 3k over msrp and they refused. |
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ugfish
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Post by ugfish on Sept 28, 2022 18:17:29 GMT -7
Wow! Crazy story! Thanks so much for the update. I hope that you're able to get delivery of an SP model sometime soon. It seems that there is very limited stock. I was able to find a base model around 200 miles away from me; but didn't have to pay crazy markup. I'm glad you were able to find one with no mark up at all. I called another dealer after finding a poster on here who had a link to on stock sp's. They had a $5000 markup!!! Wtf. I asked if they would do 3k over msrp and they refused. Glad OP got his dilemma sorted, but don’t be offering dealers anything over MSRP. They already get their nut with the doc fees they all seem to have. |
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slipwrist
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Post by slipwrist on Mar 14, 2023 21:01:59 GMT -7
I'm glad you were able to find one with no mark up at all. I called another dealer after finding a poster on here who had a link to on stock sp's. They had a $5000 markup!!! Wtf. I asked if they would do 3k over msrp and they refused. Glad OP got his dilemma sorted, but don’t be offering dealers anything over MSRP. They already get their nut with the doc fees they all seem to have. When the new gen mt09's came out in '21, some of the dealer's were jacking them up like $2k plus. On a $9400 bike, no fuckin way! Found a dealer locally that didn't even change me freight, which is one of the things they mark up the most. You can find dealer's that will sell at a reasonable price, just gotta look a little. |
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chicagotom
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Registered: Feb 19, 2024 19:49:41 GMT -7
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Post by chicagotom on Feb 19, 2024 19:53:17 GMT -7
Hey man- my 2021 mt10 with Austin racing belly exit and 2wdw tune shit the bed last night. 14,500 miles. Meticulously kept and documented all my oil changes. It started making a noise and three miles later seized up and stalled. I was able to get it to turn over and start up today and the Yama dealer but it was making loud clanking noise so I shut it off. No warranty. I have a feeling I’m going to be out of luck. Fingers crossed
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kyle
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Post by kyle on Feb 19, 2024 19:57:25 GMT -7
Hey man- my 2021 mt10 with Austin racing belly exit and 2wdw tune shit the bed last night. 14,500 miles. Meticulously kept and documented all my oil changes. It started making a noise and three miles later seized up and stalled. I was able to get it to turn over and start up today and the Yama dealer but it was making loud clanking noise so I shut it off. No warranty. I have a feeling I’m going to be out of luck. Fingers crossed Oh no... Such a bummer; I bet that's a really rough feeling. Keep us updated - hoping for the best! |
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Post by willl84 on Feb 20, 2024 6:10:14 GMT -7
Hey man- my 2021 mt10 with Austin racing belly exit and 2wdw tune shit the bed last night. 14,500 miles. Meticulously kept and documented all my oil changes. It started making a noise and three miles later seized up and stalled. I was able to get it to turn over and start up today and the Yama dealer but it was making loud clanking noise so I shut it off. No warranty. I have a feeling I’m going to be out of luck. Fingers crossed Seems to be a lot of blown MT motors popping up lately. Most have gone tens of thousands of miles with no issues. I'm at a hair over 13k on my currently with my fingers crossed. I'm meticulous about oil changes as well. One really well documented one I saw on FB (And reposted here) had cracks in the crank webs. MY guess is that the cranks are defective and have hairline cracks that let the oil pressure out and as such the main and big end rod bearings starve. I'm 100% speculating though, going off of a single failure where I noticed one thing. |
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871jz
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Post by 871jz on Aug 19, 2024 7:59:44 GMT -7
Has anyone noticed a trend on what year or year range bikes are popping motors? After four years on the GSX-S forum, I never saw one thread regarding a blown engine. Those engines are based on the world renowned K5 GSX-R1000 engines, though, so no surprise there. Plus, Suzuki is well known for building incredibly reliable bikes.
After only a few months here, I feel like I've seen a bunch. Also one or two videos of MT-10's blowing up online while guys are out riding. Not very confidence inspiring.
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Post by willl84 on Aug 20, 2024 5:21:35 GMT -7
Has anyone noticed a trend on what year or year range bikes are popping motors? After four years on the GSX-S forum, I never saw one thread regarding a blown engine. Those engines are based on the world renowned K5 GSX-R1000 engines, though, so no surprise there. Plus, Suzuki is well known for building incredibly reliable bikes. After only a few months here, I feel like I've seen a bunch. Also one or two videos of MT-10's blowing up online while guys are out riding. Not very confidence inspiring. A handful from the thousands of these that are on the road is nothing. There's guys here and on the FB groups that have 50k+ miles and are still going strong. I'm at almost 16k on my 2019 and it still runs like new. Haven't seen a second gen fail if that makes you feel better lol. |
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871jz
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Post by 871jz on Aug 20, 2024 5:44:49 GMT -7
Has anyone noticed a trend on what year or year range bikes are popping motors? After four years on the GSX-S forum, I never saw one thread regarding a blown engine. Those engines are based on the world renowned K5 GSX-R1000 engines, though, so no surprise there. Plus, Suzuki is well known for building incredibly reliable bikes. After only a few months here, I feel like I've seen a bunch. Also one or two videos of MT-10's blowing up online while guys are out riding. Not very confidence inspiring. A handful from the thousands of these that are on the road is nothing. There's guys here and on the FB groups that have 50k+ miles and are still going strong. I'm at almost 16k on my 2019 and it still runs like new. Haven't seen a second gen fail if that makes you feel better lol. That does make me feel better. Still a little uncertainty regarding the ultimate reliability coming from the GSX-S where we had guys with the faired "F" model with over 100k miles on their bikes. Never saw one blown up. It's certainly been odd seeing so many blown CP4's and then the early R1 CP4's with the bad crankshaft and/or bearing design. Can't remember exactly what the problem was, but I know there were enough engine failures that Yamaha had to address it with a redesign. It's also taken a while to get used to how much these engines lack power and smoothness down low, but mine has gotten a little better now that it's broken in. Ultimately, I'm sure it's a very small percentage of CP4's that are letting go, it's just something that I noticed which doesn't inspire confidence. Not necessarily something I'm actually concerned about happening. |
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vstate60
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Post by vstate60 on Oct 3, 2024 7:23:44 GMT -7
GSX-S has zero soul/character. Just Bleh.
My 2019 MT-10 blew up with ~9.1k miles on it...extremely clean, perfectly maintained, so on and so forth. Now I've got 2.5k on my '22 and, of course, bought the YES extended warranty this time around. 550 street/break-in miles and the rest of the 1,800-2k are from the track. Even with the hassle of the blown motor, expenses, down time, etc. due to it...I still love my Ten. Just my $0.02!
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871jz
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Post by 871jz on Oct 9, 2024 15:39:31 GMT -7
GSX-S has zero soul/character. Just Bleh. My 2019 MT-10 blew up with ~9.1k miles on it...extremely clean, perfectly maintained, so on and so forth. Now I've got 2.5k on my '22 and, of course, bought the YES extended warranty this time around. 550 street/break-in miles and the rest of the 1,800-2k are from the track. Even with the hassle of the blown motor, expenses, down time, etc. due to it...I still love my Ten. Just my $0.02! I disagree about the GSX-S1000 having no character. Not as much as the MT-10, but it was an excellent bike. The K5 engine is world renowned for being one of the best four cylinder superbike engines ever produced and after owning several GSX-R's, it showed in the performance. I had a great time with that bike. Mine was the last year of the previous generation, before they semi-neutered it, and it was incredibly reliable. Also made more horsepower and torque than the MT-10 and felt much more like a naked sport bike than the Yamaha. |
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Post by willl84 on Oct 10, 2024 5:14:45 GMT -7
GSX-S has zero soul/character. Just Bleh. My 2019 MT-10 blew up with ~9.1k miles on it...extremely clean, perfectly maintained, so on and so forth. Now I've got 2.5k on my '22 and, of course, bought the YES extended warranty this time around. 550 street/break-in miles and the rest of the 1,800-2k are from the track. Even with the hassle of the blown motor, expenses, down time, etc. due to it...I still love my Ten. Just my $0.02! I disagree about the GSX-S1000 having no character. Not as much as the MT-10, but it was an excellent bike. The K5 engine is world renowned for being one of the best four cylinder superbike engines ever produced and after owning several GSX-R's, it showed in the performance. I had a great time with that bike. Mine was the last year of the previous generation, before they semi-neutered it, and it was incredibly reliable. Also made more horsepower and torque than the MT-10 and felt much more like a naked sport bike than the Yamaha. It's strange with the more HP/TQ numbers. Wiki quotes the 2020 GSX-S1000 as 150.8/79.6 at the wheel while it quotes the MT at 131.2/72.7 at the wheel. Yet a dyno chart from 2WDW with just a slip on and no ECU flash shows 136.3/67.7 for the GSX-S and 135.6/75.5 for the MT-10 with stock exhaust, so 1HP more and almost 8ft-lb less? Then with a full exhaust and ECU flash the GSX-S gets to 147.1/78.3 while the MT with a 3/4 system and ECU flash gets to 155.1/81.6, or 8HP and 3.3 ft-lb more. GSX-S w/slip-on chart:  GSX-S full exhaust chart:  MT-10 chart:  |
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871jz
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Post by 871jz on Oct 10, 2024 9:38:28 GMT -7
I've posted them before, but these are my dyno charts from my 2020 GSX-S1000 and 2023 MT-10. Same mods, same tuner, same dyno, but different days, of course. The GSX-S made roughly 9rwhp and 4lb-ft of torque more than the MT-10. It also made that additional horsepower and torque from a lower RPM and carried those higher numbers all the way through to redline.   Take 5k RPM for instance, which is towards the beginning of the midrange where power differences are most important for (normal) street riding. At that RPM, the GSX-S made about 67hp/71tq, whereas the MT-10 made about 58hp/62tq. That's a difference of 10hp/9tq at the wheel at only 5k RPM, and after several thousand miles on each bike, that difference can absolutely be felt. I even posted a thread here previously asking about the lack of available low/midrange power from the CP4 because after everything I'd read online prior to purchasing the MT-10, I expected it to be really strong starting down low and carrying that throughout the midrange. What I found was opposite, though. The CP4 doesn't like lower RPM usage at all, whereas the K5 GSX-R1000 based GSX-S engine would cruise along all day at 2500 RPM without hesitation. At that same 2500 RPM trying to cruise along, the CP4 feels like it's going to self-destruct. That said, I would like to have the MT-10 retuned or at least dyno'd again. When I originally had it dyno tuned, it only had 166 miles on it. Now that I'm well over 2k miles, I can feel a considerable difference in low RPM power and performance. It's obvious the motor has loosened up some, which is something I didn't experience with the Suzuki. The engine never seemed to need/perform any different after a break-in period versus when it was brand new. I do expect the MT-10 to put out better numbers now that its loosened up compared to new because I can very easily feel the difference. Pics showing both bikes just for something nice to look at while we're here. 😁   |
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Post by willl84 on Oct 10, 2024 9:58:35 GMT -7
I've posted them before, but these are my dyno charts from my 2020 GSX-S1000 and 2023 MT-10. Same mods, same tuner, same dyno, but different days, of course. The GSX-S made roughly 9rwhp and 4lb-ft of torque more than the MT-10. It also made that additional horsepower and torque from a lower RPM and carried those higher numbers all the way through to redline. Take 5k RPM for instance, which is towards the beginning of the midrange where power differences are most important for (normal) street riding. At that RPM, the GSX-S made about 67hp/71tq, whereas the MT-10 made about 58hp/62tq. That's a difference of 10hp/9tq at the wheel at only 5k RPM, and after several thousand miles on each bike, that difference can absolutely be felt. I even posted a thread here previously asking about the lack of available low/midrange power from the CP4 because after everything I'd read online prior to purchasing the MT-10, I expected it to be really strong starting down low and carrying that throughout the midrange. What I found was opposite, though. The CP4 doesn't like lower RPM usage at all, whereas the K5 GSX-R1000 based GSX-S engine would cruise along all day at 2500 RPM without hesitation. At that same 2500 RPM trying to cruise along, the CP4 feels like it's going to self-destruct. That said, I would like to have the MT-10 retuned or at least dyno'd again. When I originally had it dyno tuned, it only had 166 miles on it. Now that I'm well over 2k miles, I can feel a considerable difference in low RPM power and performance. It's obvious the motor has loosened up some, which is something I didn't experience with the Suzuki. The engine never seemed to need/perform any different after a break-in period versus when it was brand new. I do expect the MT-10 to put out better numbers now that its loosened up compared to new because I can very easily feel the difference. Funny how your HP numbers are almost exactly swapped between the two bikes lol. Either way they're close. I don't feel like mine has changed much honestly. I ran mine stock with my 3/4 exhaust until like 1400 miles or so then had 2WDW do the flash. I'm a few miles short of 17k now and it doesn't feel any different since the flash, it's still bonkers in 1st and 2nd lol. |
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871jz
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Post by 871jz on Oct 10, 2024 10:03:20 GMT -7
I've posted them before, but these are my dyno charts from my 2020 GSX-S1000 and 2023 MT-10. Same mods, same tuner, same dyno, but different days, of course. The GSX-S made roughly 9rwhp and 4lb-ft of torque more than the MT-10. It also made that additional horsepower and torque from a lower RPM and carried those higher numbers all the way through to redline. Take 5k RPM for instance, which is towards the beginning of the midrange where power differences are most important for (normal) street riding. At that RPM, the GSX-S made about 67hp/71tq, whereas the MT-10 made about 58hp/62tq. That's a difference of 10hp/9tq at the wheel at only 5k RPM, and after several thousand miles on each bike, that difference can absolutely be felt. I even posted a thread here previously asking about the lack of available low/midrange power from the CP4 because after everything I'd read online prior to purchasing the MT-10, I expected it to be really strong starting down low and carrying that throughout the midrange. What I found was opposite, though. The CP4 doesn't like lower RPM usage at all, whereas the K5 GSX-R1000 based GSX-S engine would cruise along all day at 2500 RPM without hesitation. At that same 2500 RPM trying to cruise along, the CP4 feels like it's going to self-destruct. That said, I would like to have the MT-10 retuned or at least dyno'd again. When I originally had it dyno tuned, it only had 166 miles on it. Now that I'm well over 2k miles, I can feel a considerable difference in low RPM power and performance. It's obvious the motor has loosened up some, which is something I didn't experience with the Suzuki. The engine never seemed to need/perform any different after a break-in period versus when it was brand new. I do expect the MT-10 to put out better numbers now that its loosened up compared to new because I can very easily feel the difference. Funny how your HP numbers are almost exactly swapped between the two bikes lol. Either way they're close. I don't feel like mine has changed much honestly. I ran mine stock with my 3/4 exhaust until like 1400 miles or so then had 2WDW do the flash. I'm a few miles short of 17k now and it doesn't feel any different since the flash, it's still bonkers in 1st and 2nd lol. They're both very fun bikes. The GSX-S was a more stable bike and wasn't as wheelie prone. I think the longer wheelbase and longer gearing are the reasons why. It definitely felt like a more dialed in "race" oriented bike, whereas the MT-10 just feels more like a hooligan type of bike. I should have kept the GSX-S instead of selling it. Would've been nice to have both right now, as they each offer a very different riding experience. |
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Post by willl84 on Oct 11, 2024 4:02:24 GMT -7
Funny how your HP numbers are almost exactly swapped between the two bikes lol. Either way they're close. I don't feel like mine has changed much honestly. I ran mine stock with my 3/4 exhaust until like 1400 miles or so then had 2WDW do the flash. I'm a few miles short of 17k now and it doesn't feel any different since the flash, it's still bonkers in 1st and 2nd lol. They're both very fun bikes. The GSX-S was a more stable bike and wasn't as wheelie prone. I think the longer wheelbase and longer gearing are the reasons why. It definitely felt like a more dialed in "race" oriented bike, whereas the MT-10 just feels more like a hooligan type of bike. I should have kept the GSX-S instead of selling it. Would've been nice to have both right now, as they each offer a very different riding experience. I love the MT's "hooligan-ness" lol. I almost bought the GSX-S as I'm a big Suzuki guy (I loved my TLR) but the CP4 won the battle for me lol. I'm so bored with typical I4 engines that just drone on, even though the GSXR 1000 engines always sound good. |
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871jz
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Post by 871jz on Oct 12, 2024 9:29:57 GMT -7
They're both very fun bikes. The GSX-S was a more stable bike and wasn't as wheelie prone. I think the longer wheelbase and longer gearing are the reasons why. It definitely felt like a more dialed in "race" oriented bike, whereas the MT-10 just feels more like a hooligan type of bike. I should have kept the GSX-S instead of selling it. Would've been nice to have both right now, as they each offer a very different riding experience. I love the MT's "hooligan-ness" lol. I almost bought the GSX-S as I'm a big Suzuki guy (I loved my TLR) but the CP4 won the battle for me lol. I'm so bored with typical I4 engines that just drone on, even though the GSXR 1000 engines always sound good. I love the CP4, but I also miss the characteristics of a high revving normal inline four cylinder bike, probably because they're all I've ever owned. I also miss the all out performance oriented feel (and actual performance) of a sport bike. Lately, I've been considering picking up one of two bikes. Either a black 2025 R1, or a black 2025 ZX-10R. Just unsure if I want two CP4 equipped bikes or how I feel about the looks of the winglets on the '25 R1. Still undecided. Either way, I'd be keeping the MT-10. My wife and I ride together often on it and she's obviously much more comfortable on the back of the MT than she's ever been on any of my sport bikes. 🤣 |
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