willthethrill
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Post by willthethrill on May 30, 2020 2:30:31 GMT -7
Hello All!! First want to thank everyone in advance for the help!! New to the forum, but just recently moved from the fz1 forum as I traded my 2008 fz1 in for a 2020 Mt 10. So I read somewhere that a speed calibrator is not needed for the 2020 if you do a 520 conversion. Does anyone know if there is any truth to that? Only reason I find it somewhat believable is because I cannot find a a calibrator by any maker for this bike.
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pc1978
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Post by pc1978 on May 30, 2020 12:18:12 GMT -7
If you are just changing the chain size (thickness) and not the sprocket sizes, I don’t believe it should affect the calibration.
Changes in sprocket sizes is what normally causes speedo reading differences.
The speed is read by a sensor at the abs ring on the MT-10, so from what I’ve heard gearing/sprocket changes should not affect it either with this type of sensor/reading.
Many motorcycle speedometers are off from the factory though, legally allowed to be up to 10%.
I had a Honda 919 that was 10% off and I went -1 on the front tooth and was probably closer to 15% off at that point.
I have a +2 rear sprocket on my MT-10 and I’ve never checked it vs GPS, but riding behind my wife’s car it appears to be pretty close to her speedometer.
We were going 90, so any major percentage error should have been a large enough difference to discern at that speed.
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willthethrill
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Post by willthethrill on May 30, 2020 17:08:41 GMT -7
Yea I guess I should have added that I was planning to go 1 down in front or 2 up in back to see if I liked it any better compared to just a chain conversion.
I had always heard they came 3% slower stock, but never really tried proving it to be true or anything. Thank you for your reply!!
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Post by rracerfz10 on Jun 4, 2020 2:02:56 GMT -7
The FZ/MT-10 already has a 2 tooth larger rear sprocket than the R1 and people still want to gear it higher lol. I’m going the other way, 2 tooth smaller rear. I want lower RPMs on the highway and the CP4 even “detuned” in the 10 has way more than enough low/midrange torque.
Thinking also I should be able to pick up a little longer wheelbase too.
But to answer the OP’s question this bike uses a wheel speed sensor to measure speed. Changing tire profiles may affect the reading but not by much. But changing gearing won’t.
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willthethrill
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Post by willthethrill on Jun 4, 2020 2:35:26 GMT -7
The FZ/MT-10 already has a 2 tooth larger rear sprocket than the R1 and people still want to gear it higher lol. I’m going the other way, 2 tooth smaller rear. I want lower RPMs on the highway and the CP4 even “detuned” in the 10 has way more than enough low/midrange torque. Thinking also I should be able to pick up a little longer wheelbase too. But to answer the OP’s question this bike uses a wheel speed sensor to measure speed. Changing tire profiles may affect the reading but not by much. But changing gearing won’t. Thanks for the info!! See I don’t feel like it has enough on the low end (granted, just did the break in so couldn’t wind it up), but in comparison to my 2008 fz1 after dropping 1 tooth in the front, just doesn’t seem like enough for me down low. Haven’t made the change yet, so we shall see. |
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Post by rracerfz10 on Jun 4, 2020 4:36:33 GMT -7
Make sure you’re tc is on the least intrusive setting and your power mode is in the full power setting. In my 17 that’s TC on 1 (or off) and Mode B. I want to say them whack the throttle open in second gear at like 4K rpm but I don’t want you to flip over lol.
Buuuuuut what I would suggest before you mess with the gearing call Nate at 2 wheel dyno works. Get your ecu flashed with the exup valve wired open. It’s good for 150 wheel horse power. You may change your mind about the gearing
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pc1978
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Post by pc1978 on Jun 4, 2020 5:37:46 GMT -7
The FZ/MT-10 already has a 2 tooth larger rear sprocket than the R1 and people still want to gear it higher lol. I’m going the other way, 2 tooth smaller rear. I want lower RPMs on the highway and the CP4 even “detuned” in the 10 has way more than enough low/midrange torque. Thinking also I should be able to pick up a little longer wheelbase too. But to answer the OP’s question this bike uses a wheel speed sensor to measure speed. Changing tire profiles may affect the reading but not by much. But changing gearing won’t. Thanks for the info!! See I don’t feel like it has enough on the low end (granted, just did the break in so couldn’t wind it up), but in comparison to my 2008 fz1 after dropping 1 tooth in the front, just doesn’t seem like enough for me down low. Haven’t made the change yet, so we shall see. I’m happy with the +2 rear sprocket. I bought mine used and it came that way, so never experienced it with the stock size. Mine also has a mid-pipe and FTECU flash, with quickshifter and autoblipper. My previous bike was a KTM SDGT, so I was kinda used to having monster low/mid range grunt. I don’t do a lot of highway miles either. When I am on the freeway, traffic around here flows at 85-90 in the left lane. so I’m usually going (90-100 on the speedo), with some bursts above that when maneuvering. RPMs do stay up at those speeds, but for my amount of time on the freeway doesn't bother me. If I did a lot of highway miles, I probably would want it different. |
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willthethrill
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Post by willthethrill on Jun 4, 2020 20:57:52 GMT -7
Thanks for the info!! See I don’t feel like it has enough on the low end (granted, just did the break in so couldn’t wind it up), but in comparison to my 2008 fz1 after dropping 1 tooth in the front, just doesn’t seem like enough for me down low. Haven’t made the change yet, so we shall see. I’m happy with the +2 rear sprocket. I bought mine used and it came that way, so never experienced it with the stock size. Mine also has a mid-pipe and FTECU flash, with quickshifter and autoblipper. My previous bike was a KTM SDGT, so I was kinda used to having monster low/mid range grunt. I don’t do a lot of highway miles either. When I am on the freeway, traffic around here flows at 85-90 in the left lane. so I’m usually going (90-100 on the speedo), with some bursts above that when maneuvering. RPMs do stay up at those speeds, but for my amount of time on the freeway doesn't bother me. If I did a lot of highway miles, I probably would want it different. If only freeway traffic went that fast here!!! I actually rarely use the freeway, but only because the one I would use, I would have to pay to be on, and also feel like I can get where I need to be faster on secondary and state roads. Plus they aren't quite as straight  Top speed on these roads is 70, so I can afford to go up 2 teeth on the rear. Thanks for the reply!! |
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willthethrill
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Post by willthethrill on Jun 5, 2020 21:13:11 GMT -7
Make sure you’re tc is on the least intrusive setting and your power mode is in the full power setting. In my 17 that’s TC on 1 (or off) and Mode B. I want to say them whack the throttle open in second gear at like 4K rpm but I don’t want you to flip over lol. Buuuuuut what I would suggest before you mess with the gearing call Nate at 2 wheel dyno works. Get your ecu flashed with the exup valve wired open. It’s good for 150 wheel horse power. You may change your mind about the gearing I must have skimmed over your response, and just noticed it. Could there be a difference in regards to that between the 2017 and 2020? I was thinking that mode A was the full power setting when reading the manual. I do know that just after buying it and having the same bike for 12 years, the throttle response took a bit to get used to! But just like an addict..... always want more!! 😂😂 |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 5, 2020 21:45:33 GMT -7
The mode names changed from 2017 to 2018+, from STD,A,B, to 1,2,3, I believe (and in increasing order of aggressiveness). But not sure if any parameters changed too, or just the names.
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Post by rracerfz10 on Jun 5, 2020 23:01:02 GMT -7
No difference at all between the 2017 and the 2020 in the US besides the quickshifter coming standard on the 2018 and newer bikes and the change in the power modes changing from Standard-A-B to 1-2-3 as was mentioned already.
I have a 2017 I bought brand new this past January. It was a leftover I picked up new on the showroom floor for under $10k. The tune and quickshifter are must do’s in my opinion. I’ve had the bike tuned since the right after the first service and it’s definitely how this bike should’ve come from the factory. I installed the QS a week ago I believe and it’s fun for sure.
You said the key phrase. “I always want more” with a gearing change you’re not actually getting any more. You’re changing the perception of what’s all ready there. With a good tune you’re actually getting more power and getting it reliably. Not to mention all the other benefits. Smoother throttle by a lot and cooler temps because they set it to turn the fan on earlier.
I’ve changed gearing on a few of the bikes I’ve owned and I have nothing against it. I’m just saying for about the same money you’ll get a better responding smoother actually more powerful bike.
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willthethrill
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Post by willthethrill on Jun 6, 2020 21:02:26 GMT -7
No difference at all between the 2017 and the 2020 in the US besides the quickshifter coming standard on the 2018 and newer bikes and the change in the power modes changing from Standard-A-B to 1-2-3 as was mentioned already. I have a 2017 I bought brand new this past January. It was a leftover I picked up new on the showroom floor for under $10k. The tune and quickshifter are must do’s in my opinion. I’ve had the bike tuned since the right after the first service and it’s definitely how this bike should’ve come from the factory. I installed the QS a week ago I believe and it’s fun for sure. You said the key phrase. “I always want more” with a gearing change you’re not actually getting any more. You’re changing the perception of what’s all ready there. With a good tune you’re actually getting more power and getting it reliably. Not to mention all the other benefits. Smoother throttle by a lot and cooler temps because they set it to turn the fan on earlier. I’ve changed gearing on a few of the bikes I’ve owned and I have nothing against it. I’m just saying for about the same money you’ll get a better responding smoother actually more powerful bike. Yea the difference I was referring to was in tcs or throttle. Not a difference in performance or anything. I maybe should have been a little more detailed in what I was referring to. But I still have yet to purchase sprockets, but had already planned getting it tuned as well as putting on a mid pipe. So reading that the lack of an exup valve takes away from low/mid power is the major reason on changing gearing. Which is Also why I haven’t got it tuned yet either. Just getting my ducks in a row. |
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willthethrill
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Post by willthethrill on Jun 6, 2020 21:04:28 GMT -7
The mode names changed from 2017 to 2018+, from STD,A,B, to 1,2,3, I believe (and in increasing order of aggressiveness). But not sure if any parameters changed too, or just the names. Increasing order or decreasing order of aggressiveness? I’m gonna have to pull the manual out and read it again. 😂 😂 Although I do remember it being vague on defining these things. |
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olivierzx
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Post by olivierzx on Jun 7, 2020 9:49:45 GMT -7
With original (new) tires the speedometer is false of 8%. (checked on GPS at various speed)
When you read 80 mph on the bike you're really at 74.
With used tires it will be 10% error.
So if you have a + 2 rear sprocket you'll have more error between 10 and 12%.
To have a real read speed : -2 on rear is OK.
I also think that it's better to have a -2 on rear and use a -1 gear in case of power need.
But for those who changed the rear sprocket : does the speedcontrol still work ?
I ask because on the Tracer GT in this case it does not work anymore.
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Post by rracerfz10 on Jun 7, 2020 15:30:45 GMT -7
No difference at all between the 2017 and the 2020 in the US besides the quickshifter coming standard on the 2018 and newer bikes and the change in the power modes changing from Standard-A-B to 1-2-3 as was mentioned already. I have a 2017 I bought brand new this past January. It was a leftover I picked up new on the showroom floor for under $10k. The tune and quickshifter are must do’s in my opinion. I’ve had the bike tuned since the right after the first service and it’s definitely how this bike should’ve come from the factory. I installed the QS a week ago I believe and it’s fun for sure. You said the key phrase. “I always want more” with a gearing change you’re not actually getting any more. You’re changing the perception of what’s all ready there. With a good tune you’re actually getting more power and getting it reliably. Not to mention all the other benefits. Smoother throttle by a lot and cooler temps because they set it to turn the fan on earlier. I’ve changed gearing on a few of the bikes I’ve owned and I have nothing against it. I’m just saying for about the same money you’ll get a better responding smoother actually more powerful bike. Yea the difference I was referring to was in tcs or throttle. Not a difference in performance or anything. I maybe should have been a little more detailed in what I was referring to. But I still have yet to purchase sprockets, but had already planned getting it tuned as well as putting on a mid pipe. So reading that the lack of an exup valve takes away from low/mid power is the major reason on changing gearing. Which is Also why I haven’t got it tuned yet either. Just getting my ducks in a row. My exup is disconnected and safety wired open and I can tell you if there is any low to midrange power loss I can’t feel it. No this IS in conjunction with a tune so they account for it. 1st and 2nd gear power wheelies still require no effort even accidental ones. I actually think the exup (these days not so much when it was first introduced) is more for passing sound restrictions than anything else honestly. I’m not a wheelie guy by any means I’m just using that it illustrate that there is no appreciable loos in low rpm power if there even is any. |
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willthethrill
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Post by willthethrill on Jun 7, 2020 18:42:45 GMT -7
Yea the difference I was referring to was in tcs or throttle. Not a difference in performance or anything. I maybe should have been a little more detailed in what I was referring to. But I still have yet to purchase sprockets, but had already planned getting it tuned as well as putting on a mid pipe. So reading that the lack of an exup valve takes away from low/mid power is the major reason on changing gearing. Which is Also why I haven’t got it tuned yet either. Just getting my ducks in a row. My exup is disconnected and safety wired open and I can tell you if there is any low to midrange power loss I can’t feel it. No this IS in conjunction with a tube so they account for it. 1st and 2nd gear power wheelies still require no effort even accidental ones. I actually think the exup (these days not so much when it was first introduced) is more for passing sound restrictions than anything else honestly. I’m not a wheelie guy by any means I’m just using that it illustrate that there is no appreciable loos in low rpm power if there even is any. Right on, I do enjoy the occasional wheelie. But not gonna be riding the freeway doing them😂😂😆 Thank you for the valuable information!! |
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mrcdharwood
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Post by mrcdharwood on Jun 8, 2020 4:04:17 GMT -7
I've run a -1 on the front and it was horrible. Leaves you at too high revs on the open roads in 6th. Went back to stock and actually considered going -2 on the rear instead.
Speed is also taken from the rear wheel sensor so what ever you do the bike will only see the speed the rear wheel is doing.
EXUP is also only for noise. You guys inherited it from us European folk as it's cheaper to produce one bike for all markets. EXUP was originally introduced to increase back pressure at lower revs and hence more low to mid range grunt. Today's modern bikes it's solely to meet EU noise directives. It's no coincidence it opens Kait past 5500rpm which is the test limit for noise on production bikes.
A Dyno run on a stock bike actually saw it make more power with it open. Not a lot but is a free gain.
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willthethrill
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Post by willthethrill on Jun 8, 2020 15:09:38 GMT -7
I've run a -1 on the front and it was horrible. Leaves you at too high revs on the open roads in 6th. Went back to stock and actually considered going -2 on the rear instead. Speed is also taken from the rear wheel sensor so what ever you do the bike will only see the speed the rear wheel is doing. EXUP is also only for noise. You guys inherited it from us European folk as it's cheaper to produce one bike for all markets. EXUP was originally introduced to increase back pressure at lower revs and hence more low to mid range grunt. Today's modern bikes it's solely to meet EU noise directives. It's no coincidence it opens Kait past 5500rpm which is the test limit for noise on production bikes. A Dyno run on a stock bike actually saw it make more power with it open. Not a lot but is a free gain. Awesome!! Thanks for the info!! |
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Top speed on these roads is 70, so I can afford to go up 2 teeth on the rear. Thanks for the reply!!
