micke
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Post by micke on Jul 29, 2019 23:36:39 GMT -7
I have a Michelin rs** all new 200 tire and thinking about if I can use it ? I could on both Aprilia and Ktm 1290 . Tc worked well there . How is it with Yamaha mt 10sp..
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tier1
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Post by tier1 on Jul 30, 2019 10:03:50 GMT -7
For what its worth, I was at the track this past weekend talking to the Pirelli tire service guy. He mentioned putting me on a 200 rear tire once I wear out this 190. He said that they no longer bring the 190 size, all of their sizes go from 180 straight to the 200 now and that's what he recommends, and it would be an improvement
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2019 11:56:11 GMT -7
Why does the bike need the 200? Just curious. I'd argue to go back to 180, for better handling and lighter tire/wheel, but let's see the other arguments  . Maybe for a 200HP bike, but ours is 150; a 180 should be better in every regard IMO. Need to check the wheel size on our bike; for a 180, it needs to be 6.0" max. Hopefully it's the same size for a 190. I think 200 needs a wider wheel. Hopefully tire manufacturers will keep making replacement 190/55s, since I wouldn't want to change anything, if possible. |
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micke
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Post by micke on Jul 30, 2019 23:33:40 GMT -7
Why does the bike need the 200? Just curious. I'd argue to go back to 180, for better handling and lighter tire/wheel, but let's see the other arguments . Maybe for a 200HP bike, but ours is 150; a 180 should be better in every regard IMO. Need to check the wheel size on our bike; for a 180, it needs to be 6.0" max. Hopefully it's the same size for a 190. I think 200 needs a wider wheel. Hopefully tire manufacturers will keep making replacement 190/55s, since I wouldn't want to change anything, if possible. It’s for Trackdays you get some benefit in corners . For street it does not matter . Handling vise it’s the tire profile that make the bike turnin better . Anyway it looks cooler with 200 also hehe and I got one in my garage . |
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micke
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Post by micke on Jul 30, 2019 23:36:54 GMT -7
For what its worth, I was at the track this past weekend talking to the Pirelli tire service guy. He mentioned putting me on a 200 rear tire once I wear out this 190. He said that they no longer bring the 190 size, all of their sizes go from 180 straight to the 200 now and that's what he recommends, and it would be an improvement Intressting, I’m just curious if Yamahas traction control works as good with 200 as with 190 . If that pirelli dude know that 🤔 . But thx for input .👍 |
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tier1
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Post by tier1 on Jul 31, 2019 9:04:23 GMT -7
I see what you are saying in regards to the TCS, its a great question.
I just put the specs into a tire calculator; The height difference between the 190/55 and a 200/55 is 2%(.5"), which is 14 revolutions per mile. And the 200/60 is over an inch taller, now that's quite a big difference!
I cannot say with 100% certainty, but I assume the TCS logic works in the following way:
If the rear wheel speed increases at a faster rate than the front, TCS kicks in and limits power.
No idea if anything occurs for vice versa (front spinning faster than rear), but for TCS I doubt it. I'd think the issue with greater probability, would be with ABS.
So if the different sized tires were going the same speed, the 200 would be spinning slower than a 190. Assuming my TCS logic is correct, that would indicate to the TCS full traction.
Going smaller to a 180, would have the rear spinning at a faster rate than the 190. I'd think this would have more of a possibility of causing the TCS to see slippage and engage
But these are just theories. Im interested to hear some real world experiences, good topic
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Post by RedAndBlack on Jul 31, 2019 20:16:23 GMT -7
Tire sizes change the height of the rear end and changes the profile of the tire. When you take a wider tire and stick it on a rim that is designed for a thinner tire, you create a more round profile for the tire. This can reduce grip when riding in a straight line, but will generally allow more of the tire to grip the road when the bike is at angle. Additionally, since the profile is more rounded, it will change the characteristics of how the bike turns into corners and how it stands up coming out of the corners. Finally, a wider tire will raise the seat height and often, a higher seat height will improve handling.
So there are benefits. But at least in my experience, it comes largely down to feel. My track bike comes stock 180/55. I started running 190/55 and was meh. Then I ran a 180/60 and was in love. I don't think there's much difference between a 180/60 vs a 190/55 except a slightly different tire profile. But for some reason, I felt the 180/60 was 10 times better.
As far as the TCS, the TCS is measured by the wheel rings, which have holes in them to allow the sensor to determine wheel speed. This wheel ring doesn't change no matter what size tire you have on, so TCS will not be affected.
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micke
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Post by micke on Aug 1, 2019 0:47:37 GMT -7
Tire sizes change the height of the rear end and changes the profile of the tire. When you take a wider tire and stick it on a rim that is designed for a thinner tire, you create a more round profile for the tire. This can reduce grip when riding in a straight line, but will generally allow more of the tire to grip the road when the bike is at angle. Additionally, since the profile is more rounded, it will change the characteristics of how the bike turns into corners and how it stands up coming out of the corners. Finally, a wider tire will raise the seat height and often, a higher seat height will improve handling. So there are benefits. But at least in my experience, it comes largely down to feel. My track bike comes stock 180/55. I started running 190/55 and was meh. Then I ran a 180/60 and was in love. I don't think there's much difference between a 180/60 vs a 190/55 except a slightly different tire profile. But for some reason, I felt the 180/60 was 10 times better. As far as the TCS, the TCS is measured by the wheel rings, which have holes in them to allow the sensor to determine wheel speed. This wheel ring doesn't change no matter what size tire you have on, so TCS will not be affected. okay , thanks . that sounds nice |
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kratosfz10
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Post by kratosfz10 on Aug 8, 2019 16:02:28 GMT -7
I've got a 200/55 Metzeler M7RR on the rear of mine, TCS works without issue. However, I wonder if there is a limit. I know it uses the ring with gaps to detect whether or not the wheel is spinning. But is it comparing that value to a pre-programmed value, or does it just simply care whether the ring is spinning or not? The shorter the tire is, the faster the wheel will rotate, the taller it is, the slower it will rotate. I wonder if it has to be within a certain spec.
For example, on the 2017+ Ninja 1000, changing the front sprocket will throw the TCS light, but changing the rear tire does not. So does that mean changing the front sprocket makes too large of a change, or is it calculating wheel speed compared to engine speed?
Not that this matters for this particular thread, but just curios as to how it actually uses the TCS/ABS rings.
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. Maybe for a 200HP bike, but ours is 150; a 180 should be better in every regard IMO. Need to check the wheel size on our bike; for a 180, it needs to be 6.0" max. Hopefully it's the same size for a 190. I think 200 needs a wider wheel. Hopefully tire manufacturers will keep making replacement 190/55s, since I wouldn't want to change anything, if possible.
